Discussion: The 'Phoenix' files

Metamorphmagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 37939

tonks black says:

SAN - Harry had remembered the mirror when he was trying to think of a way to talk to him, but i cant remember if it was because the mirrors couldnt let the living see the dead and the other way around, or if it was because it fell out of his pocket or something.it was also a way for harry to grow.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 9:42 AM EST

Auror

House: Gryffindor
Points: 2303

padfoot5312 says:

In the Order of the Phoenix page 836 - "While you can still call home the place where your mother's blood dwells, there you cannot be touched or harmed by Voldemort. Etc.

He is protected by an ancient magic - his mother, Petunia, and Harry are all blood related. Dumbledore states there that Peturnia is her only remaining relative.

I think that if Snape (as some of you are thinking)is a relative I think Dumbledore would of told him. He was telling Harry things that he felt he should of when Harry first came to school.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 10:04 AM EST

Auror

House: Gryffindor
Points: 2303

padfoot5312 says:

Yes Remus_lupin I also feel that Dumbledore and Harry are the only ones.

Dudley having magic late in life - I don't think so. He didn't make anything happen when he was angry of scared ( Stated in the first book page 38) I don't remember in any of the books where he did it. IN the OPOP, page 19, what could be more scaring than a Dementor. Dudley is just a bully who uses his size.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 10:19 AM EST

Metamorphmagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 37939

tonks black says:

luna lovegood i think all of us wonder about james family almost as much as harry does. i dont think they went over to the dark side, cause then james would of had some evil in his as well. maybe they were killed by voldemort too.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 10:24 AM EST

Auror

House: Gryffindor
Points: 2303

padfoot5312 says:

luna lovegood - There isn't much mention on the Potters. I don't know why know one told Harry much of any thing - about his family and their friends. Could this be another reason why Harry is mad? He knows nothing about his parents or their friends. I know I would like people to tell me. Hagrid did get him pictures. JK is telling us very little about his family. Hopefully, she ties this in with Book 6. She needs to start tieing things up. I enjoy reading these books - by reading things here - many unanswer things.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 10:29 AM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

tonks black:
abt voldermort knowing occlumency himself and thus in turn limiting/screening the thoughts that he wld like harry to have.. hmm, it IS possible that he has the ability to do so knowing that he's a very powerful wizard himself. besides, he now knows that harry is able to access his own thoughts and i wldnt put it past him to manipulate harry at any chance that he has(as seen by what he did to lure harry to the MOM) like i said, the problem wld be how is harry going to discern what is voldie's real feelings and thoughts then?

loads of posts have been abt the parentage of lily and i really dun think that her father is a squib. i mean, refer to the book. it says that she's muggle born and the definition for muggle is non magic pple besides snape calls her a mudblood and this wld run contrary to the speculation that her father might have magical blood in him.

i agree with newt shcmander abt how its too presumptuous to assume that jus cause her family (minus petunia of cos) is proud of the fact that she's a witch, it does not mean that they know some stuff abt the wizarding world. an example wld be justin finch fletchy. i mean, he's muggle born and hhis mom was later happy with the reality that he's a wizard.

also, can someone tell me where did they find out that someone later in their life wld learn magic? was it provided in an interview with jkr?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 11:36 AM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

Puddifoot - Welcome! I agree that Snape must have some horrible memories from the DE days... but I wonder if we have really understood what made that memory SO bad for him. I speculated earlier that Snape may have given himself a new name, and that he may be related to Lily.

Your thoughts?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 11:51 AM EST

Squib

House: Gryffindor
Points: 109

Remus_lupin says:

Does anyone think that the possible hint that JKR gave during the Royal Albert meeting was about DD becoming the Minister of Magic and Mcgannogal becoming the Headmistress at the end of book 6

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 11:51 AM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

Hi, Polyuice13 ! I think Dudley is a good choice, and THAT would be bizzare for Harry to share the magic world with him.

I have a theory about the late bloomer being Mark Evans. I would like to know what you think...

Since there was no registry of another wizard in Harry's town, I think Mark Evans is the one to develop magically 'late' in life. Similar to Neville. (I think it is Chapter 7 of Book 1 where Neville mentions his uncle dropping him on his head and he bounced... that is how they knew he was magical AND he was 8.) SO, if 8 is considered a late bloomer... I suppose that 11 would be very late.

Why Mark, you may ask... I think it is very important that JKR mentions to us a particular boys name and age that Dudley was beating up. This seems like one of those clues JKR hides that seem like perfectly innocent background enhancement.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:01 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

tonks black - I see were you are going with the Ginny is Harry's cousin. Yes, I think that they could be cousins, but I think the level of relationship would be something like 6th or 7th removed. That is why I was asking about 'kissing cousins'.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:06 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

padfoot5312 - If I were Voldemort, the first thing that I would do after regrouping is kill Petunia. With her gone, a key part of Harry's protection is gone. Then I would strike hard at the ones Harry loves.

I think Petunia, Hagrid and several of the Weasleys will not survive Book6.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:10 PM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

hmm.. mark evans being the one to develop late? didnt fudge say smtg abt how wizards/witches births are recorded ever since voldemort's reign ended 15yrs ago? this ald mean that they wld have records of whether mark wld be a wizard wldnt it? and it says that there wasnt a wizard or a witch within miles of little whinging except for harry himself..

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:15 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

eclektic - you make some very valid points about the recording of wizards, but I still wonder if the MOM is always correct, and if the late blooming of a wizard might go unseen by the MOM. It makes me wonder, for example, was Hermione's name on the registar when she was born, OR was she recorded when she showed magic potential?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:19 PM EST

Squib

House: Gryffindor
Points: 109

Remus_lupin says:

It might be possible that Filch is the one who might develop magic late in life. Or even Mrs figg. they are Squibs remember.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:20 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

Yes, they are also good candidates. I had a crazy thought last night that it might be Grawp. Can giants be wizards? I mean pure giants... probably not.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:23 PM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

ima quidditch fan:
i agree with you totally. i mean, if i were voldemort id do the exact same thing. except, i think that voldemort himself is not aware of the strengh of the protection that surrounds harry due to the defensive blood that runs throught harry and petunia. dumbledore mentions that voldemort had always known abt this ancient branch of magic but which he despises and thus underestimated; to his cost. knowing how strongly prejudiced he feels towards certain things (eg pure blood versus muggle borns) i really wonder if his own overwhelming pride wld see him kill petunia. i think voldermort's hubris acts to strengthen him yet at the most opportune times, fails him.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:29 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

jade & Mad Eye - I read PS/SS again, and I noticed some things that I now, having read OOP, think are important.

1. (page 123 US) Harry asks Ron if he is from an ALL Wizard family, and Ron says, "I think so." He goes on to mention that his mother does have a cousin that is an accountant, but that they never talk about him.

2. (page 143 US) these is Harry's thoughts just before he is sorted... "Any second now, Professor McGonagall would come back and lead him to his doom."

About #1: What was the profession of Lily's dad?
About #2: I had a sinking spell after reading this, because is SO reminded me of the forshadowing of Sirius' death... you know the line in OOP when Harry entered #12 Grimwauld,"it was though they were entering the house of a dying perosn." I didn't think so before, but I do now... I think Harry will die in Book7. :(

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:35 PM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

ima quidditch fan:
you know, the book didnt really say if the recording of wizards and witches were made when they were given birth. which then makes me wonder now, when are they recorded if so? hm.. the ministry does have accurate ways of detecting certain magical activities. an example is the use of magic by underage wizards.. going on a tangent, isnt this a bit freaky? i mean its so much like big brother is watching, all those omniscient surviellance done by the MOM. i mean what else do they know..?
well, anyway like i was saying the recording 'exercise' is still a little sketchy so contrary to what i said earlier, mark evans might be the one who learns magic late. but sldnt he get his letter to hogwarts already since he's already 11 then?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:37 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

eclektic - As always you make a good case.... But I wonder if, as some have speculated, Umbridge goes dark, I mean darker, to Voldemort. If she would share the episode of her sending the dementors. If so, she may be the one to carry Petunia's murder out.

I agree about Voldemort's weakness, but he had has several failings lately (including those in GOF).. he HAS to do something to keep those loyal to him around... Perhaps he will appoint someone (Umbridge is my guess) to look into the ancient protection surrounding Harry. Bye-bye Petunia.

If it did happen, where would Harry go?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:42 PM EST

Marauder says:

eclektic- the thing about someone learning magic later in life was in an interview with JKR (she also said this is rarer than a squib). I can tell you the interviewwas one she gave right before OOP came out, unfortunately I can't tell you which one.
Also (although I brought this up but don't really believe it) technically a squib is a non magical person because they can't do magic. From what I can tell squibs aren't very liked/respected (possibly disowned by family) so if one of Lily's parents were squibs people may not know she has magic in her blood line and consider her a muggle.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:46 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

Since the series is from Harry's perspective, we might not find out about Mark getting a letter until Book6 (I WISH I knew the title!!!) When Harry sees him sorted....

UNLESS, here's a thought, what IF Mark's family come to visit the Harry at the Dursley's over the summer? As I suspect they are related... they may want ot ask Harry about the school or how to get supplies. I think it would be awesome for Harry to take Mark under his wing (a little brother type).

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:47 PM EST

Marauder says:

Not to ruin anyone's hopes here but if Mark would gt a letter from Hogwats he wouldn't be learing magic later in life. I took this to mean that it would be someone older (Filch, Mrs. Figg, Petunia, somone past the age of going to Hogwarts).
I don't doubt the idea that Mark Evans may get a letter, go to Hogwarts, or even be related to Harry, but I don't think he's the one JKR was talking about.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:53 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1106

Ima Quidditch Fan says:

Marauder - what an awesome point! Do you think the "acountant" that is Molly Weasley's cousin is a suib?

I really wonder if it is Lily's dad, and her father could have siblings... Mark's grandparent, or Snape's father?

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 12:54 PM EST

Marauder says:

Ima Quidditch Fan- if the Weasley's are a pure blood family than yes the cousin would be a squib.
I just thought of something strange. What if the thing Snape did to make DD trust him was to tell him that Voldemort was going to attack the Potters. DD already had the info from the prophecy so he knew why Voldeort was going to attack them.

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 1:05 PM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

wow, really interesting posts..

ok, abt umbridge being bad:
man, i dun really like to even think whether someone wld become bad. i always like to hope that they'll be good but i wldnt put it past umbridge to become a death eater and join voldie's ranks actually. i was disturbed when she admitted to sending the dememtors to attack harry but somehow it didnt really surprise me much. i mean, she is evil. her detention quill is a great example. she's jus so.. sadistic and well, voldie is too. birds of a feather flock together..

marauder: frm what u said abt the definition of a squib. i thought squibs were pple who were born into magical families but dun have a drop of magical blood in them? following ur definition, ur describing a muggle arent u? pple who cant do magic? ur right abt them getting shunned by the magical community tho. look at filch and how bitter he is..
thanks for the source of the rumor abt who learns magic later. i only trust interviews with jkr now. bad experience..
abt what happens to harry when the protection ends. i was thinking abt it. dumbledore says that till harry can call it home wld the protection be valid. what does he mean by this? does harry being the legal age restricts the pretection that he has? cos if thats the case, then the protection wld end conclusively when he has his 17th bday. seeing his bday is in june and sch term starts in sept, then he'll have an entire sch year which makes him more susceptible to voldie's attack doesnt it? in any case, if petunia does die then i think he'll be with the rest of the order and close to dumbledore..

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 1:08 PM EST

Head Girl

House: Gryffindor
Points: 479

eclektic says:

marauder:
wow.. real interesting point abt the snape thing.. it sounds really reasonable. i mean, he's a death eater, he wld then of course get inside information. he warns dumbldore abt it who then alerts the potters abt voldemort. they then perform the fidelius charm in hope that he wldnt be able to find them but it fails anyway thanks to that stinkin' rat. i've always wondered why voldie's after them and the prophecy cleared stuff up.
but, on the other hand, dumbledore did know the potters and the longbottoms since they were working for the order and as such, he wld know abt their baby boys and how one of them cld be killed by voldie. so dumbledore himself might warn the both of the families..

Posted Jul 13, 2003 at 1:19 PM EST